Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?

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Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by dreamline,
Mon Feb 22 20:07:40 1999
Much has been discussed about who built the pyramids, how they built them, when they built them, and why they built them. I'm not just talking about the pyramids in Egypt, but the pyramids all over the world. I believe I have discovered the only plausible explination which will resolve at least one mystery surrounding the pyramids. I am talking about where the idea for the shape came from. I was sitting in a chair, thinking about some abstract ideas when my cat jumped onto my lap. I pushed him off and returned to my thinking. But my cat would have none of it. He started pawing at my leg and I finally looked down. He then rolled on his back and I made an interesting observaion of his nose, when a cat is lying on his back his nose greatly resembles the shape of a pyramid. Then I thought, 'There are cats all over the world, so are the pyramids. Come to think of it, most ancient civilizations at one point or another worshipped the cat. Wouldn't that be interesting if t he whole idea for the pyramids came first from a cat? I mean surely this is not the case, but at least the shape?' I would be greatly interested to hear the thoughts of others on this subject, regardless of theory.

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by javierd,
Mon Feb 22 23:25:51 1999
interesting, expcept that...

Cats there were no all over the world in that time.

In america, cats came with the first europeans, i don't know of other parts of the world, but i don't remember any images of cats in china or Japan ...

Probably the shape comes form the fact that thats the easiest way of constructions.

And not all pyramdis are pyramidal. En Cuicuilco there is a round pyramids, and most mesomerica pyramids had steps.

The chiness pyramids looks liek i has steps, ans also the german pyramids.

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by dreamline,
Tue Feb 23 04:47:59 1999
I know, I was just being stupid. My mother and I came up with the concept, it was a pipe-dream. I thought it was funny.

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by dreamline,
Tue Feb 23 05:12:22 1999
Oh and by the way, I'm talking about the general shape, not every single contour in the pyramid, just the triangle form. As far as cats all over the world, there were cats all over the world in the forms of Jaguars, Tigers, Loins, Wild Cats, etc.
Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by shanua,
Tue Feb 23 09:35:35 1999
Imhotep was the first srchtect to creat the forrunner of the pyrimid the mastaba.

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by shanua,
Tue Feb 23 09:41:17 1999
Sorry bout that, am so tired today, can neither type nor see straight.

Of course I meant architect to create the for runner of the first pyrmid. This is well documented in the pyrimids themself. I can give you more information, if interested.

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by dreamline,
Tue Feb 23 15:35:32 1999
Well yes, I know. But I mean where did the IDEA and INSPIRATION of the pyramids come from, not who BUILT and DESIGNED them. Oh yes, a cats nose built and designed the pyramids. And then they all got into a boat and sailed around the world, spreading their idea. Even for the most eccentric historian this is a bit ludicrous. Perhaps Ohmenhotep wrote down the initial plans for the pyramids in Egypt, however this does not explain pyramids all over the world. Surely shape variations required to satisfy the available tools is moot when the essential idea for the pyramidal shape is the same. If you were to draw straight lines from the axis points, it would still be a perfect triangle. Thus variations may be due to the TYPE of cat inhabiting the particular region, available tools, or asthetic prefernces. Surely a reasonable argument cannot be made refuting the clarity of this position. In conclusion, no one here has stated an argument worthy of consideration against the INSPIRATION for the pyramid shape.

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by vincent,
Tue Feb 23 19:43:31 1999
What shows above the ground it terms of most of the pyramids is one half of an octahedron. The octahedron has been established from eternity, so even though we know that this is the form that they used we don't know what there actual thought were.

See my webpage at:

http://home.dmv.com/~vincent/

Vincent

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by dreamline,
Wed Feb 24 05:21:17 1999
You are correct. That is an argument worthy of challenging the ridiculous theory that my mother and I created.

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by charok,
Wed Feb 24 12:16:38 1999
They made little hills bigger and bigger, then decided to make huge ones with angled sides (maybe so looters couldn't climb up it). Look at the Native Americans mounds as an early stage. The Inca (or Myan I forget) only needed step pyramids because they wanted people to go up to the top.

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by javierd,
Wed Feb 24 13:10:50 1999
hi I know it is a funny idea, but i was being just a little pedantic :))

Pyramids in america came in various shapes, the ones at teotihuacan were broader, since most of the material was dirt. The piramids from the mayas were more step, since they use more stone. Aztec pyramids were something in between.

And there is alos, the round pyramid in Cuicuilco.

And there were other cultures who made pyramids. Mixtecas, zapotecas, toltecas, Tajin, Mazahuas, etc. Echas one has something unique.

Now that i think, i don't remeber any Quechua (inca) pyramid, ... A will search for ti.

Anoher kind of pyramids were the zigurats from Sumer, and babylon. We ussually don;t think of the as pyramids because some reconstruction are really wild.

Somwhere i read that the exact angles form the egyptians pyramids came form the fact that only a few pyramidal shapes obtained with square stones.

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by dreamline,
Wed Feb 24 14:44:27 1999
Cool. Thanks for your input and time, my mother and I just wanted to have a little fun with it. Although, I really was wondering if anyone would respond to such a stupid theory.

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by armaetno,
Wed Feb 24 17:16:28 1999
People: Maybe you will find your answer in a site I found today: "Eguptology Resources". The address is: www.newton.cam.ac.uk/egypt/ Hope you like it.

One more thing, despite their shape, which looks like the Egyptian pyramids (therefore the popular name), the structures that have been found in the Americas arenot pyramids, and have very little in common with the Egyptian structures. These are "stepped temples", build over long periods of time. The shape came from the addition of a new levels on top of existing ones.

Another thing. Although cats were brought to the Americas by the Europeans explorers in the XVI century (with mice and rats), there were other species of "cats", like pumas and jaguars, in the "New World". Many Amerindian societies considered these as sacred.

Have fun, Armaetno

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by javierd,
Thu Feb 25 01:48:19 1999
Each 52 years, a new structure was build over the pyramid, covering the whole structure, not just a new level, this has make it posible to found some facades in a very good state of conservations.

And yes, i forgot, that between olmec and mayas the Jaguar was sacred, although i don,t think i would make it as a domestic cat :-)

Have fun...

Javier Delgado

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by moonlady,
Fri Feb 26 14:50:00 1999
The Inca and related civilizations did not have pyramids. They did build an amazing fortress called "Sacsuhuaman" which is a symmetrical zig-zag of stone. It is much bigger in person than it appears in photos!

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by liangcheng,
Sat Feb 27 20:10:55 1999
Here's my personal hypothesis of why pyramids were all built with the same basic shape:

Ancient civilizations were smarter than most people today give them credit for. First of all, I believe the builders were well aware of the simple dynamics of how steep a sand pile could get before avalanching (or quickly learned this after a major disaster or two). This determined the maximum angle for which the sides of an extremely tall and massive structure could be built safely without worrying about any limitations on height, even if earth, irregular stones, or bricks were used. Since square blocks are naturally best suited and simplist to fabricate for building structures, naturally a structure built with these blocks would tend to have square foundations as a result. In order to achieve the highest elevations safely without the extreme weight of the overlying blocks crushing the ones below or causing the structure to avalanche, the structure would need sloped walls.

My conclusion: Mankind's use of a simple law of 'sand pile physics' combined with natural extentions of the basic shape of the building blocks used resulted in the most probable shape for a very tall and massive structure to be pyramid like. The cardinal points (north, east, south, and west) would have naturally been chosen to align the foundations and therefor the entire pyramid like structure.

This is only my personal hypothesis concerning this matter.

;-)) Liangcheng

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by dreamline,
Sat Feb 27 21:54:30 1999
I tend to agree with that theory

.
Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by armaetno,
Tue Mar 2 16:07:52 1999
Guys: Gizza wasn't the only location where pyramids where build. Building a pyramid wasn't an easy task; there are several case where the mighty Egyptians failed (i.e. the "Bended Pyramid"). I bet the Incas and Mayas also, ocasionally, had construction problems, as we do today. Armaetno

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by kdigs,
Tue Mar 2 21:12:23 1999
armaetno is right, and although i am not an egyptologist either most of my archaeology colleagues and i have theory, dates dont matter and location dont matter, it was all a part of worship, they worshiped many differant gods all over the world, and the pyramids point to the sky, its a symbol sort of, and there are many "deformed" and unfinished pyramids in egypt, i saw the bent one

-----kdigs

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by dreamline,
Wed Mar 3 19:44:14 1999
For those of you who have not started at the opening entries for this topic, you may wish to do yourself a favor and do so. This topic is a frivolous, light hearted entry intended for amusement only. Some people get so serious! Thanks for all the fun!
Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by moonlady,
Thu Mar 4 09:19:48 1999
I concur with kdigs theory that all pyramids point to the sky. Ancient civilizations were closely linked to the passage of time, and time was measured by celestial events and formations. Also, the sky was home to many of the gods and one would ascend the pyramid (the stepped ones, anyway) in order to take a gift to a god.

BTW there are no pyramids in Peru that I know of, Incan or otherwise. There are a lot of other very interesting things, though. At Macchu Pichu, both the temple of the sun and the temple of the moon are at the highest place large enough and flat enough for them to be built. However, there are a number of terraces and buildings higher than the temples.

There is a mountain adjacent to Macchu Pichu where human remains were found at a level quite a bit higher than the main site. I remember seeing a TV show about this, probably on Discovery or Learning channel. The remains were that of a young girl and it was hypothesized that she had been specially chosen and carefully taken to the site, where she was ritually sacrified to the gods. They believe she was of noble status or possibly elevated to that status when selected for sacrifice, and that she had been drugged and left on the mountain to die. The mountain is, of course, quite steep and pointing to the sky.
Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by kazuya,
Sun Mar 7 19:45:56 1999
I read it was so the pharoah could take his test to be accepted into heaven. As he progresses he rises to the top, where its a tip. From there, his final and uppermost point, he supposedly ascends to heaven.

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by aijin,
Wed Mar 10 13:34:27 1999
Bye the bye; Japan has its own distinctive cat, the Japanese Bobtail. I know I raise them. Egypt; Imhotep for pharoah Djoser. stick one mastaba on top of another, and make each one slightly smaller and you have the first pyramid. Cute but crazy idea. Next you will be telling me that kitties taught humans to use language. Not too crazy that idea! LOL!!!! Cats do civilize people. That is a fact.

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by dreamline,
Sat Mar 13 12:25:50 1999
LOL!!!!!! At least someone else caught the joke, a lot of people thought I was serious!
Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by innerflame,
Sat Mar 13 21:30:40 1999
I and have read that Egyptian pyramids were made from a combination of Moonlady and Aijin's theories.

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by joesdiscoveryscreen,
Mon Mar 15 03:28:31 1999
Ok,, my idea of why the pyramids are shaped the way they are.. Ehem,, (clearing my imaginary throat). Well first off, I myself believe there was an ancient atmosphere that the Earth used to be surrounded by. A layer of Water/ice which may have existed during the time of the pyramids, and explains dinosaur lung capacity and answers many riddles including the great flood. If this atmosphere did exist and was during the time of pyramids first constructions, it would stand to reason that they perhaps were in fear that the sky would fall on them, and they need a suitable protection from this. There is a story about chicken little,, which may prove to be older than imagined, and may even prove to be true,, at some point, but for now,, I am sure I will be laughed at. However, none the less, this is my idea and contribution to this topic. One day they will find that the world was indeed covered in a layer of water, which protected our earth from "free radicals" and "UV rays" and was the reaso n that lifeforms were so large and had small lungs, and couldn't fly in our current atmosphere if they did still exist. It will explain the great flood, and perhaps,, as I have said, it may lead to the idea that the pyramids were built for protection from the heavens,, from the sky falling..

Thank you PEACE+++

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by joesdiscoveryscreen,
Mon Mar 15 09:21:57 1999

Oh,, geez almost fergot,, I found a way cool website that describes the function of the Pyramid, or a very good theory anyway,, which also deserves attention for anyone interested in the pyramids... the web address is :

http://www.thepump.org/built.html

and it is a MUST SEE SITE!! It is amazing, and I am grateful that my friend showed it to me,, and hopefully you will appreciate that I have mentioned it to you.. PEACE++ again,, and good luck in finding the answers.. :)

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by sammy76,
Wed Mar 17 18:30:17 1999
Chicken got a little and lost his head to the Kentucky kernal. My geometry teacher got the idea.

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by liangcheng,
Wed Mar 17 18:58:36 1999
Try:

Chinese Pyramids

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by hutt,
Wed Mar 17 20:45:58 1999
I hope this will be of interest to everyone. I watched a show on the Discovery Channel called "Egypt Uncovered". I also bought the book, so I am quoting out of the book:

The pyramids were resurrection machines. The Egyptians theory was that the at the beginning of the world, there was only a watery void which was called Nun and it contained the essence of all creation. Out of this arose a mound and on that mound appeared the sun god Ra-Atum. From him the rest of creation issued forth as he rose in the sky, only to plunge back into the chaotic void with every sunset to be re-created again. The Egyptians believed this happened continously, not just once, but a never ending cycle and that by linking up with this cosmic cycle they too could emerge reborn.

The pyramid was essentially this mound of creation, a cocoon in which the king underwent the transformation or re-creation into an eternal transfigured spirit called an akh. Journeying to the sky, he was united with the gods and resurrected each morning.

I paraphased the first paragraph but typed directly from the book.

I hope this helps and is of interest. I highly recommend this book for anyone interested in Egyptology. I am not as smart as a lot of people in these discussions are but I could not resist posting this as I thought this was very appropriate.

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by hutt,
Wed Mar 17 20:46:38 1999
I hope this will be of interest to everyone. I watched a show on the Discovery Channel called "Egypt Uncovered". I also bought the book, so I am quoting out of the book:

The pyramids were resurrection machines. The Egyptians theory was that the at the beginning of the world, there was only a watery void which was called Nun and it contained the essence of all creation. Out of this arose a mound and on that mound appeared the sun god Ra-Atum. From him the rest of creation issued forth as he rose in the sky, only to plunge back into the chaotic void with every sunset to be re-created again. The Egyptians believed this happened continously, not just once, but a never ending cycle and that by linking up with this cosmic cycle they too could emerge reborn.

The pyramid was essentially this mound of creation, a cocoon in which the king underwent the transformation or re-creation into an eternal transfigured spirit called an akh. Journeying to the sky, he was united with the gods and resurrected each morning.

I paraphased the first paragraph but typed directly from the book.

I hope this helps and is of interest. I highly recommend this book for anyone interested in Egyptology. I am not as smart as a lot of people in these discussions are but I could not resist posting this as I thought this was very appropriate.

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by navarre7,
Fri Mar 26 20:56:22 1999
I thought Mice ruled the world?

Um here's my theory (could be others, haven't had time to check it yet) Scientists in explaining the pyramid-like shapes on Mars point back to naturally occuring sand pyramids. These are made by wind and are quite small (on the planet Mars the wind is a lot stronger causeing giant pyramids). Could this be the original idea behind them? Simple is good :)
Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by javierd,
Wed Apr 7 16:16:44 1999
I found a very interesting info about this subject, there is a book named "the prefilosophical tought" by H.A. Frankfort.

The first thing to note, is that every year Egipt is subject to inundations, so all the land is is covered by a gret plain of water. Then slowly, some hills here and there begin to appear, and they are recieved as the promise for the renovation of the new life.

And one of the myth of the creation (Egyptians ussually had several myths for the same things) starts with a great plain, and slowly apeared the first hill.

The hill of the creation.

And the pyramids are symbols of this hill, representing the promise of the renewal of life.

Javier Delgado

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by lonnieshiv,
Mon Apr 19 05:59:01 1999
dreamline that cat of yours is a real trouble maker

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by armaetno,
Tue Apr 20 11:14:16 1999
Javier: The story of the "Egyptian Creation", reminds me a bit of the Taínos' myth of the creation of man. Some researchers believe that the belief that men came out of a cave in a mountain was the reason why the Tainos' idols included many "three pointed stones" (Zemis). According to this theory the central point represents the mountain from which men emerged into the world. Despite this fact, there are no pyramids, nor even remotely similar structures, in any site in the Caribbean islands. Saludos, Armaetno
Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by javierd,
Thu Apr 22 15:17:19 1999
interesting, mmh, maybe the diference was that to egyptians saw the hills or mountains were a simbolr of rebirth.

What kinds of strucure are found in the Caribean? do youn knwo something about this?

But who really knows, altought it is very fun to speculate :)

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by armaetno,
Thu Apr 22 17:00:30 1999
Javier: The most significant prehispanic structures found in the Caribbean are "bateyes" or ballcourts, where the Taíno played a game very similar to the game played in Meso-Ammerica by the Mayas and Aztects. However, the courts where much simpler. Large stones or boulders marked the playing field. Most of the boulders had simple engravings (petrogliphs). It is believed that the game was ado[pted by the Taíno thru some type of contact with Meso-America, since the game is not found in Amazonia, the area where the Taínos originated. Armaetno

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by befehlshaber,
Tue Jun 1 05:23:33 1999
The shape of the pyramids came from the Egyptians observations of their natural landscape. Such form was perceived to withstand the forces of nature and the ravages of time. Perfect for their purpose of constructing a resurrection machine built to last. What's that Arab saying? Something to tyhe effect that "all things fear time, but time fears the pryamids."
Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by oni,
Sun Jun 6 10:50:32 1999
I've been told from my engineer friends that a pyramid is the most stable structure design. I'm almost sure that the ancients knew this, and put it into effect.

The pyramids from all over the world were incredible structures for their time, considering that even a three story structure was almost completely unheard-of.

just a thought :)

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by javierd,
Sun Jun 6 21:00:59 1999
Yes but it took time to get the correct angle, there is one bend piramid, with a change of angle (they started it too step), and there is another pyramid that actually collapsed.

There is a lot of people that thinks that Egyptiasn "suddenly" knew how to make pyrmids, but acually it took some time to learn.

Javier Delgado

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by oni,
Mon Jun 7 14:27:36 1999
I'm sure it did take time. Every invention in history has either taken a lot of tries and mistakes, or was stumbled upon accidentally.

Also, I made a bit of a mistake. I was told that on a larger scale dome structures are actually more stable than pyramids, because they are self-supporting.

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by armaetno,
Mon Jun 7 19:49:34 1999
Hello Everyone: Monday June 7, 1999 10:30 PM EST. Just at this very moment the History Channel (Sorry DC) is showing a program ("Pyramids") that shows the history and evolution of these structures. Hope you can get to watch it. It seems very good.

Armaetno

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by rocky5,
Sun Jun 20 11:45:21 1999
hi.. i've been reading all your messages, especially "the cat theory" which i found very cute, but lately a programm on discovery channel, made me wounder about the whole existence of the pyramids and the sphinx... according to that programm, the great pyramids were built according to the shape of the stars, a constellation called "the great giant" -or somthing else, i can't recall the name- and it's possible that a civilisation lost in time , around 10 000 b-c, built the sphinx, and not the egyptians, so it's really becoming more and more confusing, this is prouved by the ecological reports, and astronomy, it seems that the sphinx is built in a way to face the sun on the day of the 21 of march, so the only time, he would be facing in the same time the leo constellation(since he's built on a leo shape) , would be around 10 000 b-c, same thing for the pyramids concerning the "giant constellation"so... what is this great civilisation, who managed such great monuments, in 10 000 b-c, a civilisation last in time?????
Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by javierd,
Mon Jun 21 00:42:24 1999
hi rocky5,

would you join us in the "ancient civilizations" thread?

we have been busy discusing that hypotesis :)))

Javier Delgado

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by armaetno,
Thu Jun 24 19:47:32 1999
Hello Everyone: A couple of days ago I was visiting my brother (a Civil Engineer) and I bumped into a copy of the magazine "Civil Engineering" (June 1999, Vol. 69, No. 6), which has the article "Project Management B.C." by Craig B. Smith on how the pyramids at Giza were built. Naturally, I "borrowed" the magazine (just for the next 20-30 years). So if you are interested on learning how a modern engineer sees the construction of the pyramids, I recommend the article.

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by walley,
Fri Jun 25 08:01:29 1999
This article is mentioned in today's DCOL Newsbriefs. It is mentioned that the pyramids were built quicker than estimated. How many months/year of actual construcion was allowed for?

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by javierd,
Fri Jun 25 17:39:06 1999
Can you comment on this, it sounds interesting.

in the web there is another study http://www.geocities.com/~menkaure/pyramid/index.htm

I would like to compare both.

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by ufomind,
Thu Jul 8 16:54:17 1999
The Giant thing rocky5 was talking about is the constelation Orion.

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by dreamline,
Fri Jul 9 19:34:08 1999
More spacifically, Orion's belt. And the sphinx was built to great the rising of the sun through constellation of Leo. No new news here.

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by dreamline,
Fri Jul 9 19:36:00 1999
Sorry, I'm half asleep. Great - greet

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by coednakedjake,
Thu Jul 29 22:18:59 1999
This may be off the topic a bit, but I'm new at this, and I am really curious. It has been determined that the pyramids of Egypt coincide with the 3 stars in Orion's belt. These stars point to the North Star, the brightest in Earth's sky. So, what were the Egyptians trying to signify, or point out with the positions of the 3 pyramids? Could this have some further earthly meaning?

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by avernus,
Sun Aug 1 16:37:32 1999
Astronomical correlations are nearly impossible not to find. Speaking of correlations my cat looks awfully like the sphinx, I wonder if there is a connection.

Where Did The Idea For The Shape Of The Pyramids Come From?
by dreamline,
Tue Aug 3 15:15:04 1999
All cats resemble the Sphinx, Pat, and not many people need to make light of it. However, there are inscriptions in the pyramids about Orion's belt and how the Pharaoh becomes a star after death and joins in Orion's belt. So :P